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Next: Ride Report - Orlando/Key West
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Since: Nov 08, 2007
Posts: 37
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:05 pm
Post subject: another update on your greenhorn
Archived from groups: rec>motorcycles (more info?)
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Hello ladies and germs...
Just wanted to thank everyone for the advice. All the advice. Was
riding from work and thinking that my engine sounds awesome because i
ran through b-12, my ride is smooth because i blip when i come down
from high speeds, and all of these improvements were FREE. I'm not
sure how i would have figured out any of that without expense, time,
or embarrasment. I really appreciate it.
I admit i'm becoming a lane splitter when riding in NYC traffic under
10 mph. I'm serious about my 10 mph limit ... if i'm in 2nd gear, i
take up a whole lane and use blinkers and am otherwise normal. If i'm
in 1st gear, i pretty much ride like i'm on a bicycle when in rush
hour hell. I know it's illegal, but it's safe - stopping distance is
like 4 feet and traffic is used to bicycles and vespas flinging by
when traffic stops.
I'm picking up my winter gear after the last week of cold/rainy
weather. Got the Jett heated vest i read about on webBikeWorld and
invested in some really heavy duty motorcycle gloves - came highly
reviewed, near-waterproof and well-reinforced and with several layers
to keep warm. I'm sort of counting on the heated vest warming me up
nicely, but i'm not getting my hopes up. Haven't got it yet.
Took my windshield off. Great timing, right? Just as the air gets
cold. It's somehow a totally different experience. I had the urge, on
my first ride, that it was odd to not have a seatbelt. It's like i
just started riding again, like i just realized how riding a bike is
like riding a rocket-horse. It's really quite a change. I figure
having it off will prompt me to stay off highways, and that's really
the best way to ride anyway. It feels very "lazy" to ride with it on.
I got my vanity plate in the mail, pretty happy about that. Not to
sound like an exceptional nerd, but i named my bike after a character
in a video game i used to play. Pretty hilarious incongruity, posting
my beautiful cruiser (i'm humble about my skills and arrogant as hell
about how my bike looks....that's ok, right?) on web forums for the
game. Feel free to mock me =)
I'm not sure if i said this before, so at risk of repeating myself ...
i'm really happy with my choice in bikes - both size (805cc) and style
(cruiser) -- and, further, brand (suzuki and not HD, not that i could
afford HD). I know i'd be taking risks if i had a bike that could do
it.
Planning on getting saddlebags, not sure if i want hard bags for
security and looks or soft bags for superior functionality (except the
locking part...which doesn't seem really crucial, honestly). It's
strange hardbags are roughly $400-$600. They're fiberglass, or
plastic, no? Seems like a ripoff.
I've honestly found myself daydreaming of living someplace warmer,
mostly so i can ride, but also because not being able to ride when
it's icy is a very practical indicator that i'm not as happy living in
the north east as i might be elsewhere. So...north carolina? Maybe i
should just work on better winter riding gear?
Been parking on the sidewalk with plates off - i know some low-traffic
streets where it just works out nicely. Minor problems with EZ pass
(never mounted it to the windshield because i never wanted to keep it
on ... always in a pocket, functioning is sporadic).
Pipes are on my wishlist, but somehow i think i'd be some kind of RUB
asswipe for doing that. I will do it, or i'll sell for a bike with
pipes, but i need to figure out how to make it make sense to me. I
only care about the sound, and that makes me feel like it's an
investment in ego and i don't want that to be the case (but i can't
find some way around that...i don't honestly care about the
performance).
I struggled a bit with the idea that my bike is an aesthetic ripoff of
a harley fatboy. Truthfully all bikes are ripoffs of something - to
"win" against that idea i'd have to buy a 1940 fatboy ... even a
modern harley is an imitation of itself. It was somewhat annoying, i
felt like a poser - not because i'm an american riding a jap bike -
because i owned a product that was a counterfeit of another (brand
doesn't matter). I realized though i was just being simplistic ... if
one really looks at the details, a suzuki is pretty distinct. Or maybe
i just tell myself that?
And that's it. Really, this is one of the best things i've done for
myself. Again, thanks to everyone (well, almost) for the attention and
the advice. I hope to continue asking questions on this board and i
feel like maybe i can help some newer-than-me people get at least to
where i am (but i won't advocate lanesplitting to anyone who isn't
doing it in 1st gear in NYC rush hour).
-c |
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Since: Oct 16, 2007
Posts: 918
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:24 pm
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 18:05:38 -0800 (PST), c
wrote:
>Hello ladies and germs...
>
>Just wanted to thank everyone for the advice. All the advice. Was
>riding from work and thinking that my engine sounds awesome because i
>ran through b-12, my ride is smooth because i blip when i come down
>from high speeds, and all of these improvements were FREE. I'm not
>sure how i would have figured out any of that without expense, time,
>or embarrasment. I really appreciate it.
>
>I admit i'm becoming a lane splitter when riding in NYC traffic under
>10 mph.
Great. Another newbie rider breaking the law ( not legal in
NYC or NY state ), in city traffic where hitting people and things (
especially if you drive a cab ) is considered a hobby or a sport, not
an accident.
You are what is called 'an organ donor'.
> I'm serious about my 10 mph limit ... if i'm in 2nd gear, i
>take up a whole lane and use blinkers and am otherwise normal. If i'm
>in 1st gear, i pretty much ride like i'm on a bicycle when in rush
>hour hell. I know it's illegal, but it's safe - stopping distance is
>like 4 feet and traffic is used to bicycles and vespas flinging by
>when traffic stops.
And when some cab passenger suddenly opens his door in
preparation to getting out, right when you're at about the rrear bumpe
and doing 10 MPH, so you have maybe 3 feet to stop **AFTER** your
mind reacts to it - organ donor.
>I've honestly found myself daydreaming of living someplace warmer,
>mostly so i can ride, but also because not being able to ride when
>it's icy is a very practical indicator that i'm not as happy living in
>the north east as i might be elsewhere. So...north carolina? Maybe i
>should just work on better winter riding gear?
You want to live CLOSER to me ??? 
>Been parking on the sidewalk with plates off - i know some low-traffic
>streets where it just works out nicely. Minor problems with EZ pass
>(never mounted it to the windshield because i never wanted to keep it
>on ... always in a pocket, functioning is sporadic).
Good, you're learning to break ALL the laws at the same time.
>And that's it. Really, this is one of the best things i've done for
>myself. Again, thanks to everyone (well, almost) for the attention and
>the advice. I hope to continue asking questions on this board and i
>feel like maybe i can help some newer-than-me people get at least to
>where i am (but i won't advocate lanesplitting to anyone who isn't
>doing it in 1st gear in NYC rush hour).
Yes, you can help them learn how to fill out an organ donor
card. You HAVE done that, right ?
--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/
Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
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Albrecht via MotorcycleKB
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Since: Jun 07, 2007
Posts: 1060
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:36 pm
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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c wrote:
>Was
>riding from work and thinking that my engine sounds awesome because i
>ran through b-12, my ride is smooth because i blip when i come down
>from high speeds, and all of these improvements were FREE.
Good. I'm glad B12 worked out for you so well.
> I'm sort of counting on the heated vest warming me up
>nicely, but i'm not getting my hopes up. Haven't got it yet.
Heated vests work, but you can run into problems adding electrical equipment
to your motorcycle. Even if you hook your accessory plug directly to the
battery, the generator still has to charge the battery, and the generator
plug can get hot and melt if it's not making good condition. So, find out
where the generator plug is at and where the voltage regulator okug is and
feel them to see if they are getting really hot when you have the electric
vest turned on.
Your alternator is on the left side of the engine. The voltage regulator
should be on the left side of the bike too.
voltage regulator
http://demo.motorsportdealers.com/modules/oemparts/partsimage.gifx?t=2...1114182
magneto
http://demo.motorsportdealers.com/modules/oemparts/partsimage.gifx?t=2...1114182
>Planning on getting saddlebags, not sure if i want hard bags for
>security and looks or soft bags for superior functionality (except the
>locking part...which doesn't seem really crucial, honestly). It's
>strange hardbags are roughly $400-$600. They're fiberglass, or
>plastic, no? Seems like a ripoff.
Leather saddlebags would look better on a cruiser, IMO. Some older Harleys
did have some narrow fiberglass saddlebags though, I just saw one go by the
other day.
>
>I've honestly found myself daydreaming of living someplace warmer,
>mostly so i can ride, but also because not being able to ride when
>it's icy is a very practical indicator that i'm not as happy living in
>the north east as i might be elsewhere. So...north carolina? Maybe i
>should just work on better winter riding gear?
Ride down to Daytona if you can get two weeks off during March.
>
>Pipes are on my wishlist, but somehow i think i'd be some kind of RUB
>asswipe for doing that. I will do it, or i'll sell for a bike with
>pipes, but i need to figure out how to make it make sense to me. I
>only care about the sound, and that makes me feel like it's an
>investment in ego and i don't want that to be the case (but i can't
>find some way around that...i don't honestly care about the
>performance).
Well, you won't get any more performance with loud pipes. They are just for
styling and sound and they are expensive. If you buy aftermarket pipes, save
your stock pipes in case you get a fix-it ticket.
>
>I struggled a bit with the idea that my bike is an aesthetic ripoff of
>a harley fatboy. Truthfully all bikes are ripoffs of something - to
>"win" against that idea i'd have to buy a 1940 fatboy ... even a
>modern harley is an imitation of itself. It was somewhat annoying, i
>felt like a poser - not because i'm an american riding a jap bike -
>because i owned a product that was a counterfeit of another (brand
>doesn't matter). I realized though i was just being simplistic ... if
>one really looks at the details, a suzuki is pretty distinct. Or maybe
>i just tell myself that?
Suzuki's Intruder and Volusia come damned close to capturing the essential
chopper and cruiser looks of the late 1960's.
The Japanese market researchers interviewed motorcycle riders back in the
late 1970's and asked what they wanted, and they said "V-twin cruisers!"
Of course they thought that the researchers would understand that they meant
Harley Davidsons. But the Japanese copied the Harleys and now we have
motrcycles that look so much like Harleys they fool people who should know
better.
Like, the first time I saw a Honda Shadow American Classic Edition, I thought
I was looking at a Harley.
--
Message posted via MotorcycleKB.com
http://www.motorcyclekb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/bike/200711/1 >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Nov 08, 2007
Posts: 37
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 8:01 am
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 14, 9:39 pm, "Albrecht via MotorcycleKB.com"
wrote:
> c wrote:
> >Was
> >riding from work and thinking that my engine sounds awesome because i
> >ran through b-12, my ride is smooth because i blip when i come down
> >from high speeds, and all of these improvements were FREE.
>
> Good. I'm glad B12 worked out for you so well.
If carburetors were baseball, you'd have scored 1 RBI against my
$tealer$hip, because i scored bigtime.
>
> > I'm sort of counting on the heated vest warming me up
> >nicely, but i'm not getting my hopes up. Haven't got it yet.
>
> Heated vests work, but you can run into problems adding electrical equipment
> to your motorcycle. Even if you hook your accessory plug directly to the
> battery, the generator still has to charge the battery, and the generator
> plug can get hot and melt if it's not making good condition. So, find out
> where the generator plug is at and where the voltage regulator okug is and
> feel them to see if they are getting really hot when you have the electric
> vest turned on.
>
That's actually the main point behind THIS vest - it's self-contained
and battery powered. No tether, no draining my bike battery, no wear
on the electricals, etc.
Here's the link to the review which sold me:
http://www.webbikeworld.com/r3/heated-vest/battery-heated-vest/
I'll post back when i've gone riding in the cold with it on (should
get it next week).
> Your alternator is on the left side of the engine. The voltage regulator
> should be on the left side of the bike too.
>
> voltage regulatorhttp://demo.motorsportdealers.com/modules/oemparts/partsimage...fx?t=..
>
> magnetohttp://demo.motorsportdealers.com/modules/oemparts/partsimage.gifx?t=...
>
I always did wonder about that =)
> >Planning on getting saddlebags, not sure if i want hard bags for
> >security and looks or soft bags for superior functionality (except the
> >locking part...which doesn't seem really crucial, honestly). It's
> >strange hardbags are roughly $400-$600. They're fiberglass, or
> >plastic, no? Seems like a ripoff.
>
> Leather saddlebags would look better on a cruiser, IMO. Some older Harleys
> did have some narrow fiberglass saddlebags though, I just saw one go by the
> other day.
>
>
Eh, i'll think on it endlessly until the cash burns a hole in my
pocket.
>
> >I've honestly found myself daydreaming of living someplace warmer,
> >mostly so i can ride, but also because not being able to ride when
> >it's icy is a very practical indicator that i'm not as happy living in
> >the north east as i might be elsewhere. So...north carolina? Maybe i
> >should just work on better winter riding gear?
>
> Ride down to Daytona if you can get two weeks off during March.
>
>
I can't. Kind of a slave in this point in my life. Part of why i love
the bike, it's an escape.
>
> >Pipes are on my wishlist, but somehow i think i'd be some kind of RUB
> >asswipe for doing that. I will do it, or i'll sell for a bike with
> >pipes, but i need to figure out how to make it make sense to me. I
> >only care about the sound, and that makes me feel like it's an
> >investment in ego and i don't want that to be the case (but i can't
> >find some way around that...i don't honestly care about the
> >performance).
>
> Well, you won't get any more performance with loud pipes. They are just for
> styling and sound and they are expensive. If you buy aftermarket pipes, save
> your stock pipes in case you get a fix-it ticket.
>
>
Will definitely save my old pipes if i get new ones. I have a bunch of
idiot friends who dropped half a grand on a stupid iphone. I'd be just
like that, except with a louder bike. It's not quite the same, but it
just seems like ... what am i really getting? It sounds amazing, but
couldn't i just hacksaw my pipes shorter and not feel like a tool? Or
remove the baffles?
Would i need a welder's help to do any of this pipe stuff?
>
> Suzuki's Intruder and Volusia come damned close to capturing the essential
> chopper and cruiser looks of the late 1960's.
>
Yes, and that's what bothered me. Would you buy an american version of
a samurai sword? No effin' way, right? Why would you (anyone) buy a
jap version of an american motorcycle?
I actually posted to the volusia community on volusiariders.com, and
they ripped me a new one. Apparently my eye is not discerning enough.
I think they were overly defensive because they know it's true. Their
arguments to rationalize were (1) that everything is a ripoff of
something and (2) nothing is a rip off of anything, everything is
distinguishable. But in truth, who would want a HD when a suzuki is
technologically superior? You'd have to want it for the intangible
appeal of that brand, and buying into that would make you more of a
tool than owning a counterfeit (in my opinion). So i don't want a HD,
i just want something that isn't a knock off of something else. It
seems though, in the 21st century, all motorcycles are a knock off of
something and are also their own animals if you look closely enough.
Whatever, a paradox. I love my bike. I don't like the idea that its
roots are in another company. I love that my used bike cost about 20%
of what a used HD would have cost.
> The Japanese market researchers interviewed motorcycle riders back in the
> late 1970's and asked what they wanted, and they said "V-twin cruisers!"
>
> Of course they thought that the researchers would understand that they meant
> Harley Davidsons. But the Japanese copied the Harleys and now we have
> motrcycles that look so much like Harleys they fool people who should know
> better.
>
> Like, the first time I saw a Honda Shadow American Classic Edition, I thought
> I was looking at a Harley.
>
I saw a fatboy and was like, "oh, that's my bike's grandpa ... my
adopted bike..."
> --
> Message posted via MotorcycleKB.comhttp://www.motorcyclekb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/bike/200711/1 >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Apr 09, 2007
Posts: 152
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:58 pm
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Albrecht via MotorcycleKB.com" wrote:
>c wrote:
<snip>
>>Would i need a welder's help to do any of this pipe stuff?
>
>Only if you're trying to make up some crude looking custom pipes that most
>cruiser riders will laugh at when they
>see them. To a cruiser rider, the exhaust system is sacred, it has to look
>and sound good.
More important, perhaps, is that an engine is a tuned system and one
cannot alter its exhaust system and reasonably expect to not degrade its
performance without also appropriately altering it intake system.
<snip>
--
========================================================================
Michael Kesti | "And like, one and one don't make
| two, one and one make one."
mrkesti at hotmail dot com | - The Who, Bargain >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Jul 03, 2003
Posts: 152
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:42 pm
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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c wrote:
: I admit i'm becoming a lane splitter when riding in NYC traffic under
: 10 mph. I'm serious about my 10 mph limit ... if i'm in 2nd gear, i
: take up a whole lane and use blinkers and am otherwise normal. If i'm
: in 1st gear, i pretty much ride like i'm on a bicycle when in rush
: hour hell. I know it's illegal, but it's safe - stopping distance is
: like 4 feet and traffic is used to bicycles and vespas flinging by
: when traffic stops.
You and me both. I live in DC where scooters are all over the place.
They park on sidewalks, lane split, use the bike lanes and so on.
One of the blessings of having these scooters all over the place is as you
say, the cagers have grown used to it. In stopped traffic I'll ride up
between the lane and the parked cars to the right (keeping an eye out for
doors) - I've never had anyone get annoyed and I've even had people move
over slightly to let me by. I guess they're also worried about their
mirrors...
In any case, in three years I've only been yelled at by one cop (on foot)
who told me I shouldn't be in the same lane as the parked cars. I said
sorry and got out for 50 feet then got back in. Otherwise I've passed
cops in traffic like this with no problems.
I asked a parking enforcement lady once if she'd ticket a motorcycle if it
were parked on the sidewalk and she looked at me like I was crazy and said
"of course not."
Justin
'07 Suzuki SV650
'02 Honda Shadow VT750 >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Albrecht via MotorcycleKB
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External
Since: Jun 07, 2007
Posts: 1060
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:41 pm
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Albrecht via MotorcycleKB
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External
Since: Jun 07, 2007
Posts: 1060
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:50 am
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c wrote:
>The rest have
>probably never given a split second's thought to altering the intake
>to keep balance in the engine after altering the exhaust. And don't
>any of you believe i'm implying that the few cruiser guys i've met
>with hyperchargers were intending to keep balance or were thinking
>about it -- it either "gives more horsepower" or "looks good" (in
>their words), but the idea of input/output balance never came up.
Most knowledgeable riders who know about performance would pick a sportbike
or an inline-4 retro standard if they wanted to tweak with exhaust systems
and air boxes and carburetors and jetting themselves.
Or, if they owned a Ducati or an Aprilia they would go to the Euro-Emporium
and write a huge check to get the factory race kit that adds a lot of
horsepower while shortening engine life by a factor of 10 and they would let
the mechanic install it.
Aftermarket exhaust systems rarely liberate power that was mysteriously
hidden in your engine and somehow overlooked by "stupid engineers".
The engineers make a compromise when they design an exhaust system. The
engine might put out 10 more horsepower, if a louder exhaust system was
fitted,
but the engineers usually settle on a design that's easy to ride because it
has enough low end torque.
The higher horsepower that comes from a loud exhaust might occur at 1500 RPM
higher than stock, and many street riders would not want to rev the engine
higher in their daily commute because they would have to shift gears more and
ride harder to get the performance boost.
Hard riding is just antithetical to the relaxed cruiser model of slow putting
and staying in one gear.
Cruisers have rarely been raced, they are not generally considered as
candidates for displacement class competition, so they aren't limited to some
particular engine size.
And this has spurred the development of larger and larger engines in cruisers,
one of the largest is about 2300cc, three times the size of your Volusia's
engine.
Such a large engine needs a huge muffler to keep it quiet, even when the
rider is putting slowly.
--
Message posted via http://www.motorcyclekb.com >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Aug 08, 2006
Posts: 1000
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:02 pm
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On Nov 15, 1:25 pm, c wrote:
> I won't pay actual money for just bragging rights.
Well, maybe owning a Harley instead of a metric cruiser isn't ONLY
about bragging rights. You claim that the Suzuki Volusia is
technologically superior to Harley-Davidson. Is that true? If so, is
it true in all respects, or only in some? Is it true of all Harley
Davidson models? Is it true of all metric cruisers as compared to
all Harley-Davidson models? Is the fact that some components on a
Harley-Davidson are made in foreign countries enough to completely
discount the desire of some Americans to underwrite the American
economy by choosing an American made Harley, even if it does contain
some imported parts, or is that just a perception?
Even though you're new to all this, can you not discover any reasons
other than bragging rights why Harley outsells the metric cruisers in
the U.S., in spite of being measurably more expensive at the time of
initial purchase?
Have you considered build quality? Fit and finish? Belt drive versus
chain or shaft? Parts costs? Parts support? Aftermarket support?
Dealer network? Resale value? Performance enhancement
availability? Variety of models? Individual model variants and
specialty models? Is it possible that in any of those areas, Harley-
Davidson might offer some compelling reason to consider their products
rather than those of their competition?
Hey, I'm only asking. I rode everything but Harleys for 26 of my 30
years riding, and I still love both my current Ducatis as much as I do
my current Harley. I like all bikes, and I'm not averse to having
part of the reason for owning a bike being "bragging rights." But I
sure as hell don't think that is the ONLY thing separating Harley
buyers from buyers of metric cruisers.
Do you? Really?
Tim
P.S. Buy a plug-in electric vest. Don't waste your money on the
battery powered one, especially if you are on a tight budget! (Just
don't buy the plug-in vest solely for bragging rights!!!!  >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Aug 08, 2006
Posts: 1000
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:04 pm
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On Nov 15, 1:30 pm, "Justin" wrote:
> One of the blessings of having these scooters all over the place is as you
> say, the cagers have grown used to it. In stopped traffic I'll ride up
> between the lane and the parked cars to the right (keeping an eye out for
> doors) - I've never had anyone get annoyed and I've even had people move
> over slightly to let me by. I guess they're also worried about their
> mirrors...
Oh, Justin, you are in BIG TROUBLE now. Our resident motorcycle
safety (and etiquette) expert, is gonna have to ream you a new one for
riding like that!! >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Oct 22, 2005
Posts: 454
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 1:28 am
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2007 07:18:57 -0800 (PST), c
wrote:
>And Albrecht wasn't putting me down (nor you), he was just making a
>statement about cruiser riders in general. Or so i believe. He's been
>to helpful to start hating now.
If you happen to be Jewish, black or Mexican, just keep it under your
hat and you'll do fine...
And, with his motorcycling advice, don't be gullible. He does know a
some things quite well, but he also has a habit of pretending he's an
authority on things he has no expertise in - he's been caught
bullshitting more than a few times in recent months.
>From what i've seen in the few months i've been around cruiser guys,
>it's true (his statement). I think maybe two or three guys have
>hyperchargers, though only one actually knew what it did (or could
>answer my question about what it was - he wasn't 100%). The rest have
>probably never given a split second's thought to altering the intake
>to keep balance in the engine after altering the exhaust. And don't
>any of you believe i'm implying that the few cruiser guys i've met
>with hyperchargers were intending to keep balance or were thinking
>about it -- it either "gives more horsepower" or "looks good" (in
>their words), but the idea of input/output balance never came up.
You don't know as much as you think then. On Harleys, Stage 1
upgrades are as common as rain. That an increase to the 'input'.
And btw, on the heat vest question, don't buy the battery-powered one.
Batterys are expensive, fussy, last-resort means - for hikers, not
bikers. Tap into your bike's electrical system. The vest won't draw
much.
--
Home page: http://xidos.ca >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Oct 22, 2005
Posts: 454
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:55 am
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2007 21:02:37 -0800 (PST), "tomorrow@erols.com"
wrote:
>P.S. Buy a plug-in electric vest. Don't waste your money on the
>battery powered one, especially if you are on a tight budget! (Just
>don't buy the plug-in vest solely for bragging rights!!!!
Where I live, some people *don't* buy them for bragging rights.
--
Home page: http://xidos.ca >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Apr 06, 2007
Posts: 661
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 8:24 am
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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tomorrow RemoveThis @erols.com wrote:
> On Nov 15, 1:25 pm, c wrote:
>
>> I won't pay actual money for just bragging rights.
>
> Well, maybe owning a Harley instead of a metric cruiser isn't ONLY
> about bragging rights. You claim that the Suzuki Volusia is
> technologically superior to Harley-Davidson. Is that true? If so,
> is
> it true in all respects, or only in some? Is it true of all Harley
> Davidson models? Is it true of all metric cruisers as compared to
> all Harley-Davidson models? Is the fact that some components on a
> Harley-Davidson are made in foreign countries enough to completely
> discount the desire of some Americans to underwrite the American
> economy by choosing an American made Harley, even if it does contain
> some imported parts, or is that just a perception?
>
> Even though you're new to all this, can you not discover any reasons
> other than bragging rights why Harley outsells the metric cruisers
> in
> the U.S., in spite of being measurably more expensive at the time of
> initial purchase?
>
> Have you considered build quality? Fit and finish? Belt drive
> versus
> chain or shaft? Parts costs? Parts support? Aftermarket support?
> Dealer network? Resale value? Performance enhancement
> availability? Variety of models? Individual model variants and
> specialty models? Is it possible that in any of those areas,
> Harley-
> Davidson might offer some compelling reason to consider their
> products
> rather than those of their competition?
>
> Hey, I'm only asking. I rode everything but Harleys for 26 of my 30
> years riding, and I still love both my current Ducatis as much as I
> do
> my current Harley. I like all bikes, and I'm not averse to having
> part of the reason for owning a bike being "bragging rights." But I
> sure as hell don't think that is the ONLY thing separating Harley
> buyers from buyers of metric cruisers.
Actually it's Harley marketing that's the difference. "Bragging
rights"? Bragging about what, that they could afford to buy a
motorcycle that sits in the garage when it's not being trailered
about?
It's adopting an image and a culture. Harley these days isn't about
riding motorcycles, it's about socializing and networking. Harley as
a company has carefully nurtured that culture. Most Harleys are
hangar queens--gotten out and trailered to where the other Harley
riders are going to be gathering so that they can all be taken off
their trailers and shown around, then occasionally ridden a few miles
in the group ride, then taken home and carefully cleaned and polished
and put away until next time--they have as much relevance to their
riders' day-to-day lives as a set of golf clubs.
Get on your bike, ride to the other end of the country, count the
bikes you see on the road, count the Harleys and I think you'll begin
to get the picture.
> Do you? Really?
>
> Tim
>
> P.S. Buy a plug-in electric vest. Don't waste your money on the
> battery powered one, especially if you are on a tight budget! (Just
> don't buy the plug-in vest solely for bragging rights!!!!
--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Aug 08, 2006
Posts: 1000
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 10:08 am
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 17, 8:24 am, "J. Clarke" wrote:
> tomor....TakeThisOut@erols.com wrote:
> > On Nov 15, 1:25 pm, c wrote:
>
> >> I won't pay actual money for just bragging rights.
>
> > Well, maybe owning a Harley instead of a metric cruiser isn't ONLY
> > about bragging rights. You claim that the Suzuki Volusia is
> > technologically superior to Harley-Davidson. Is that true? If so,
> > is
> > it true in all respects, or only in some? Is it true of all Harley
> > Davidson models? Is it true of all metric cruisers as compared to
> > all Harley-Davidson models? Is the fact that some components on a
> > Harley-Davidson are made in foreign countries enough to completely
> > discount the desire of some Americans to underwrite the American
> > economy by choosing an American made Harley, even if it does contain
> > some imported parts, or is that just a perception?
>
> > Even though you're new to all this, can you not discover any reasons
> > other than bragging rights why Harley outsells the metric cruisers
> > in
> > the U.S., in spite of being measurably more expensive at the time of
> > initial purchase?
>
> > Have you considered build quality? Fit and finish? Belt drive
> > versus
> > chain or shaft? Parts costs? Parts support? Aftermarket support?
> > Dealer network? Resale value? Performance enhancement
> > availability? Variety of models? Individual model variants and
> > specialty models? Is it possible that in any of those areas,
> > Harley-
> > Davidson might offer some compelling reason to consider their
> > products
> > rather than those of their competition?
>
> > Hey, I'm only asking. I rode everything but Harleys for 26 of my 30
> > years riding, and I still love both my current Ducatis as much as I
> > do
> > my current Harley. I like all bikes, and I'm not averse to having
> > part of the reason for owning a bike being "bragging rights." But I
> > sure as hell don't think that is the ONLY thing separating Harley
> > buyers from buyers of metric cruisers.
>
> Actually it's Harley marketing that's the difference. "Bragging
> rights"? Bragging about what, that they could afford to buy a
> motorcycle that sits in the garage when it's not being trailered
> about?
Huh. My Harley is two years old and has 25,000 miles on it. Doesn't
spend much time being trailered or sitting in the garage. I presume
you ride your non-Harley much. much more than that, correct?
> It's adopting an image and a culture. Harley these days isn't about
> riding motorcycles, it's about socializing and networking. Harley as
> a company has carefully nurtured that culture. Most Harleys are
> hangar queens--gotten out and trailered to where the other Harley
> riders are going to be gathering so that they can all be taken off
> their trailers and shown around, then occasionally ridden a few miles
> in the group ride, then taken home and carefully cleaned and polished
> and put away until next time--they have as much relevance to their
> riders' day-to-day lives as a set of golf clubs.
Well, that's a nice stereotype you've repeated there. I kind of
believed it myself when I very carefully and studiously avoided people
who owned and rode Harleys (or any other kind of cruiser). Then, when
I started meeting them and getting to know them, the comfortable,
lazy, idiotic stereotype just fell apart.
> Get on your bike, ride to the other end of the country, count the
> bikes you see on the road, count the Harleys and I think you'll begin
> to get the picture.
You're right, of course. I've done that a couple of times now, and
been amazed that the percentage of Harleys being ridden long distances
and out of state is MUCH higher then their actual representative
numbers overall. >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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Since: Dec 22, 2003
Posts: 1430
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:44 am
Post subject: For SAKE!! Holiday plans etc [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Fri, 16 Nov 2007 21:02:37 -0800 (PST), "tomorrow@erols.com"
wrote:
>Even though you're new to all this, can you not discover any reasons
>other than bragging rights why Harley outsells the metric cruisers in
>the U.S., in spite of being measurably more expensive at the time of
>initial purchase?
Of course. The overwhelming majority of Americans are totally clueless
morons, susceptible to the simplest brainwashing. The other country
where Harleys are revered is Germany, and we know what sheep they are.
Don't believe me? Just ask the MI5 dude. He knows how much Americans
have been duped.
--
Turby the Turbosurfer >> Stay informed about: another update on your greenhorn |
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