The future of EC/PI track days...

On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:39:57 +1100, John Littler
<johnblockspamlittler.RemoveThis@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

 >Thanks Nev. Looks like they're a $100 dearer, no laptiming and no
 >overtaking unless you're 3m apart !!
 >
 >Doesn't sound much chop to me.
 >
 >JL


ahhhh..... monopolies......

paulh<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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paulh wrote:

 > On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:39:57 +1100, John Littler
 > <johnblockspamlittler.RemoveThis@iprimus.com.au> wrote:
 >
 >
  >>Thanks Nev. Looks like they're a $100 dearer, no laptiming and no
  >>overtaking unless you're 3m apart !!
  >>
  >>Doesn't sound much chop to me.
  >>
  >>JL
 >
 > ahhhh..... monopolies......

Ah, well, yes, but....as John L will no doubt explain, a monopoly in
something as non-essential as track days, might not be worth all that much.

  regards,
   CrazyCam<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

manson wrote:
 > paulh wrote:
 >
  >> On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:39:57 +1100, John Littler
  >> <johnblockspamlittler.DeleteThis@iprimus.com.au> wrote:
  >>
  >>
   >>> Thanks Nev. Looks like they're a $100 dearer, no laptiming and no
   >>> overtaking unless you're 3m apart !!
   >>>
   >>> Doesn't sound much chop to me.
   >>>
   >>> JL
  >>
  >>
  >> ahhhh..... monopolies......
 >
 >
 > Ah, well, yes, but....as John L will no doubt explain, a monopoly in
 > something as non-essential as track days, might not be worth all that much.

You're right that it is discretionary expenditure for most, and there
are actually a couple of substitutes (not nearly as good though), would
suggest there will be a reduction in numbers but I suspect for the
majority who do ride days regularly the price increase will be forgotten
quickly, for the rest they'll go less often and make hoons of themselves
on the Putty and Old Rd...

JL
(in other words there will be differences in utility and elasticity
between consumers of these services
--
Poor fellow my country.
Australians do not care that their PM is a liar.
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.johnhowardlies.com/" target="_blank">http://www.johnhowardlies.com/</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

Not just dearer. Only 6 x 20 min sessions each day as opposed to the 8
offerred by most of the previous operators.

Lets see. We'll base a comparison on a weekend ride day, booking within 7
days or or paying on the day, as many do in order to get a better idea of
the weather.

Previous operators prices were around $160 for 8 sessions so we get $20.00
per session. With Superbike School charging $219 for 6 sessions we get
$36.50 per session. An increase of roughly 82%. Gee, aren't monopolies
wonderful...

I believe a number of complaints have been sent to both the ARDC (Eastern
Creeks operatoras) and ACCC on these developments. Seems to me for the ARDC
to exclude other qualified operators and then in concert with the exlusive
rights holder up the price by this amount is as anticompetitive as it gets.

Hopefully customers will send a clear message as to their thoughts on this
by voting with their feet....

Chris

"John Littler" <johnblockspamlittler.TakeThisOut@iprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:37o1lfF5fgg0dU1@individual.net...
 > Thanks Nev. Looks like they're a $100 dearer, no laptiming and no
 > overtaking unless you're 3m apart !!
 >
 > Doesn't sound much chop to me.
 >
 > JL
 >
 > Nev.. wrote:
  > > Copied from another forum...
  > >
  > > ===================================
  > >
  > > A lot has been happening in the Ride Day industry of late and
  > > in-particular there has been much discussion about the operation of
  > > Eastern Creek Ride Days now and into the future.
  > >
  > > Unfortunately much of the information that has been going around is
  > > grossly inaccurate, whether innocently begun and altered along the way
  > > creating the 'Chinese whisper' effect, or intentionally started by other
  > > operators to dissuade riders from attending future Eastern Creek Ride
  > > Days, either way it has caused a great deal of confusion amongst regular
  > > Eastern Creek Ride Day attendees. To overcome this trend of both
  > > deliberate and innocent misinformation, we have released a "Notice to
  > > Eastern Creek Ride Day Participants" in both Two Wheels (issue released
  > > 17th Feb.) and AMCN (issue released 23rd Feb.) which outlines what has
  > > happened to date, along with some information regarding future standards
  > > for Eastern Creek Ride Days.
  > >
  > > As well as this notice, we have created a new website which is very
  > > informative and should have pretty much everything you need to decide
  > > whether or not you would like to attend the new look Eastern Creek Ride
  > > Days. The website address is <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.easterncreekridedays.com.au" target="_blank">www.easterncreekridedays.com.au</a> .
  > >
  > > Bookings can be taken on-line or for further information (or to book via
  > > phone), call 1300 793 423.
  > >
  > > Until then...
  > >
  > > Good luck with your riding,
  > > Steve Brouggy
  > >
  > > Eastern Creek Ride Days
<font color=green>  > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.easterncreekridedays.com.au</font" target="_blank">www.easterncreekridedays.com.au</font</a>>
  > > Phillip Island Ride Days
<font color=green>  > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.phillipislandridedays.com.au</font" target="_blank">www.phillipislandridedays.com.au</font</a>>
  > > Australian Superbike School
<font color=green>  > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.superbikeschool.com.au</font" target="_blank">www.superbikeschool.com.au</font</a>>
  > >
  > > Ph 1300 793 423
  > > Fax (03) 9792 1075
  > > P.O. Box 2068
  > > Dandenong Vic 3175
  > >
  > >
  > >
  > > Nev..
  > > '03 ZX12R
 >
 >
 > --
 > Poor fellow my country.
 > Australians do not care that their PM is a liar.
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.johnhowardlies.com/</font" target="_blank">http://www.johnhowardlies.com/</font</a>><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

"ChrisR1" <chrisandkels.TakeThisOut@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:42182ffa$0$5187$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
 > Not just dearer. Only 6 x 20 min sessions each day as opposed to the 8
 > offerred by most of the previous operators.
 >
 > Lets see. We'll base a comparison on a weekend ride day, booking within 7
 > days or or paying on the day, as many do in order to get a better idea of
 > the weather.
 >
 > Previous operators prices were around $160 for 8 sessions so we get
 > $20.00
 > per session. With Superbike School charging $219 for 6 sessions we get
 > $36.50 per session. An increase of roughly 82%. Gee, aren't monopolies
 > wonderful...

there was quite a few $100 -$120 days around

I did a $110 last month with a 3+ booking

thursday is a $100 witha 3+ booking

the last i did was an 8 session day , but as it was near the end of the day
and most
were packed and heading home i managed a 9th session

2 in a row which were the best and hardest i rode all day nearly killed me ,
but it was so worth it

so in that 9 sessions i got 50% more than they are offering for $169

110/9 = $12.22
169/6 = $28.16

when it was first mooted Steve Brougy said no discounts at this time

soon changing how it all works

 >
 > I believe a number of complaints have been sent to both the ARDC (Eastern
 > Creeks operatoras) and ACCC on these developments. Seems to me for the
 > ARDC
 > to exclude other qualified operators and then in concert with the exlusive
 > rights holder up the price by this amount is as anticompetitive as it
 > gets.
 >
 > Hopefully customers will send a clear message as to their thoughts on this
 > by voting with their feet....

hmm maybe they vote with their tyres ??

 >
 > Chris<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

"John Littler" <johnblockspamlittler DeleteThis @iprimus.com.au> wrote in message
news:37pqogF5f1m61U1@individual.net...
 > manson wrote:
but I suspect for the
 > majority who do ride days regularly the price increase will be forgotten
 > quickly, for the rest they'll go less often and make hoons of themselves
 > on the Putty and Old Rd...
 >

Of course.... all these track days have reduced the accident rate on the
Old Road... oh.. it hasn't.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Hello, ChrisR1!
You wrote on Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:36:30 +1000:


C> Hopefully customers will send a clear message as to their thoughts on
C> this by voting with their feet....

Sucks I know, but I don't think this is likely - where else can they go or who else can they choose?
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

"Farque Khantz" <mehere DeleteThis @home.on.the.net> wrote in message
news:4218f7b8$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
 > Hello, ChrisR1!
 > You wrote on Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:36:30 +1000:
 >
 >
 > C> Hopefully customers will send a clear message as to their thoughts on
 > C> this by voting with their feet....
 >
 > Sucks I know, but I don't think this is likely - where else can they go or
who else can they choose?
 >
 >
Guess there's always Oran Park??

What annoys me is that Eastern Creek's stated reason for going with a sole
operator was supposedly to enforce a minimum standard of safety and
operational rigour by track day operators. Their argument is that they were
best able to do this by working with one operator. I'm sure the fact that in
the process the lack of other operators removes pricing competition enabling
higher prices had nothing to do with it....

They would have been able to achieve the above by simply establishing a set
of rules and an accreditation process for ride day operators. Don't meet the
rules and standards, you can't run a day at EC. Maybe operators would have
had to increase prices to make the grade, but at least then competition on
pricing still would have existed......

Chris<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Hello, ChrisR1!
You wrote on Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:10:58 +1000:

C> Guess there's always Oran Park??

Do they run ride days there??

C> What annoys me is that Eastern Creek's stated reason for going with a
C> sole operator was supposedly to enforce a minimum standard of safety and
C> operational rigour by track day operators. Their argument is that they
C> were best able to do this by working with one operator. I'm sure the
C> fact that in the process the lack of other operators removes pricing
C> competition enabling higher prices had nothing to do with it....

Money. That's what it's all about, pure and simple. You and I both know it.

C> They would have been able to achieve the above by simply establishing a
C> set of rules and an accreditation process for ride day operators. Don't
C> meet the rules and standards, you can't run a day at EC. Maybe operators
C> would have had to increase prices to make the grade, but at least then
C> competition on pricing still would have existed......

C> Chris

Couldn't agree more. If they had set a standard, ALL ride day operators would've complied and we would still see some competition.

--
Mick
FmxAustralia.Com Motorcycle Accessories
shop.fmxaustralia.com
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

"ChrisR1" <chrisandkels DeleteThis @optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:4219433e$0$6166$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

 >
 > What annoys me is that Eastern Creek's stated reason for going with a sole
 > operator was supposedly to enforce a minimum standard of safety and
 > operational rigour by track day operators. Their argument is that they
 > were
 > best able to do this by working with one operator. I'm sure the fact that
 > in
 > the process the lack of other operators removes pricing competition
 > enabling
 > higher prices had nothing to do with it....
 >
 > They would have been able to achieve the above by simply establishing a
 > set
 > of rules and an accreditation process for ride day operators. Don't meet
 > the
 > rules and standards, you can't run a day at EC. Maybe operators would have
 > had to increase prices to make the grade, but at least then competition on
 > pricing still would have existed......
 >
 > Chris
 >

Hey Chris (aka spannerhead)

Heard today that Brouggy has dropped his price to 169 - assume that must be
weekdays but unsure - as he has not many (indeed if any) booking.

Guess your wish came true with people voting with their feet.

ck

p.s. the 'aka' gives away who this is huh?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

"ck" <me RemoveThis @here.com> wrote in message news:42195474$1@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
 >
 > "ChrisR1" <chrisandkels RemoveThis @optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
 > news:4219433e$0$6166$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
 >
  >>
  >> What annoys me is that Eastern Creek's stated reason for going with a
  >> sole
  >> operator was supposedly to enforce a minimum standard of safety and
  >> operational rigour by track day operators. Their argument is that they
  >> were
  >> best able to do this by working with one operator. I'm sure the fact that
  >> in
  >> the process the lack of other operators removes pricing competition
  >> enabling
  >> higher prices had nothing to do with it....
  >>
  >> They would have been able to achieve the above by simply establishing a
  >> set
  >> of rules and an accreditation process for ride day operators. Don't meet
  >> the
  >> rules and standards, you can't run a day at EC. Maybe operators would
  >> have
  >> had to increase prices to make the grade, but at least then competition
  >> on
  >> pricing still would have existed......

i think you will find it had a great deal to do with the guy that got killed
drag racing the wrong way

  >>
  >> Chris
  >>
 >
 > Hey Chris (aka spannerhead)
 >
 > Heard today that Brouggy has dropped his price to 169 - assume that must
 > be
 > weekdays but unsure - as he has not many (indeed if any) booking.

heard ? read the website , all the details are there

 >
 > Guess your wish came true with people voting with their feet.
 >
 > ck
 >
 > p.s. the 'aka' gives away who this is huh?
 >
 >
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: The future of EC/PI track days... 

Yeah, yeah. I know its you

"ck" <me.TakeThisOut@here.com> wrote in message news:42195474$1@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
 >
 > "ChrisR1" <chrisandkels.TakeThisOut@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
 > news:4219433e$0$6166$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
 >
  > >
  > > What annoys me is that Eastern Creek's stated reason for going with a
sole
  > > operator was supposedly to enforce a minimum standard of safety and
  > > operational rigour by track day operators. Their argument is that they
  > > were
  > > best able to do this by working with one operator. I'm sure the fact
that
  > > in
  > > the process the lack of other operators removes pricing competition
  > > enabling
  > > higher prices had nothing to do with it....
  > >
  > > They would have been able to achieve the above by simply establishing a
  > > set
  > > of rules and an accreditation process for ride day operators. Don't meet
  > > the
  > > rules and standards, you can't run a day at EC. Maybe operators would
have
  > > had to increase prices to make the grade, but at least then competition
on
  > > pricing still would have existed......
  > >
  > > Chris
  > >
 >
 > Hey Chris (aka spannerhead)
 >
 > Heard today that Brouggy has dropped his price to 169 - assume that must
be
 > weekdays but unsure - as he has not many (indeed if any) booking.
 >
 > Guess your wish came true with people voting with their feet.
 >
 > ck
 >
 > p.s. the 'aka' gives away who this is huh?
 >
 >
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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