My first Dead Battery - I think?

Get a charger, life is not possible without one, I've had mine for 20 years
now! Honest, this tool pays for itself over and over.

 >Subject: My first Dead Battery - I think?
 >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com
 >Date: 1/14/2004 7:28 PM Pacific Standard Time
 >Message-id: <1074137315.632313.RemoveThis@nntp.acecape.com>
 >
 >
 >I felt like going for a ride a little while ago but the bike did not start
 >.
 >my first mistake was I tried to start it for about 3 seconds with out the
 >choke.
 >after I pulled the choke out all the way - I tried for about another 3
 >seconds.
 >after that the engine would crank very slow almost to a stop. after I would
 >let it rest
 >a minute or 2 it would crank nice for about 2 seconds and die down. lol I
 >ever tried to push start the thing
 >by myself. im thinking of getting a
 >battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens Saturday when
 >it will be 30F.
 >im not sure how cold it was tonight at 6pm but im sure it was between 10F
 >and 4F.
 >on cold days I can push the bike in my not so warm hallway but not sure how
 >long I will have
 >to leave it there to make a difference and don't want to block others that
 >have to pass.
 >I really want to drive Saturday - I just don't know if I should get the damn
 >charger now
 >or see if the bike starts Saturday after the battery rested and I will
 >attempt to make the bike
 >warmer before starting AND will use the choke right from the get go.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

yep looks like I need one of those much more then a tachometer.
any recommendations on a charger - what not to get - what to get?
I cant believe how hard it is to get to the damn battery on motorcycles.
I can understand the placement of the battery, but why not have some kind of
extension under one of the plastic panels or something. I will also have to
remove
the alarm each time I have to charge the battery . I am also wondering
what would
happen if I boosted the battery with the jump start gizmo I bought for me
car.
thanks for the reply.
Tom

--
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.diabetes.org/homepage.jsp" target="_blank">http://www.diabetes.org/homepage.jsp</a>
Extreme-cc's
39 - Male - Type - 2
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/memberdetail.cfm?user_ID=162139" target="_blank">http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/memberdetail.cfm?user_ID=162139</a>


"Rolavine" <rolavine.TakeThisOut@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040115130522.24620.00000011@mb-m13.aol.com...
 > Get a charger, life is not possible without one, I've had mine for 20
years
 > now! Honest, this tool pays for itself over and over.
 >
  > >Subject: My first Dead Battery - I think?
  > >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com
  > >Date: 1/14/2004 7:28 PM Pacific Standard Time
  > >Message-id: <1074137315.632313.TakeThisOut@nntp.acecape.com>
  > >
  > >
  > >I felt like going for a ride a little while ago but the bike did not
start
  > >.
  > >my first mistake was I tried to start it for about 3 seconds with out the
  > >choke.
  > >after I pulled the choke out all the way - I tried for about another 3
  > >seconds.
  > >after that the engine would crank very slow almost to a stop. after I
would
  > >let it rest
  > >a minute or 2 it would crank nice for about 2 seconds and die down. lol
I
  > >ever tried to push start the thing
  > >by myself. im thinking of getting a
  > >battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens Saturday
when
  > >it will be 30F.
  > >im not sure how cold it was tonight at 6pm but im sure it was between 10F
  > >and 4F.
  > >on cold days I can push the bike in my not so warm hallway but not sure
how
  > >long I will have
  > >to leave it there to make a difference and don't want to block others
that
  > >have to pass.
  > >I really want to drive Saturday - I just don't know if I should get the
damn
  > >charger now
  > >or see if the bike starts Saturday after the battery rested and I will
  > >attempt to make the bike
  > >warmer before starting AND will use the choke right from the get go.
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

 >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com

 >yep looks like I need one of those much more then a tachometer. any
recommendations on a charger - what not to get - what to get?

Oh, well. You will see fancy-schmancey digital-controlled battery tending
devices in the catalogs for $25 to $50.

Pay what you like, but I am a cheapskate.

I can get the smallest conceivable battery chargers for almost nothing at
second hand stores. The output is less than 1 amp, usually about 600 to 800
milliamps. They are power supplies for charging the batteries in various
consumer electronic devices which people buy and use a few times and then
donate to a charity, like Good Will, or the Salvation Army...

I saw a whole pile of them in a local thrift store, while I was buying an old
Compaq Presario for $13. The monitor cost $7. The keyboard was almost new, I
paid $4. The mouse cost $3. A power cable cost $1.

The whole system cost me $28. It gets me on the web...

I have a battery charger that I got for free, out of a trash can. I cut the
plug off the end and soldered terminals onto the wires to hook up to my
battery. It will charge the battery up to 15 volts, and I have been using it
for years...

If you're like me, you may even already own such a trickle charger. It may be
sitting in a drawer, next to some electronic gizmo that you just had to have
when they were all the rage ten years ago...

How do you know that a used charger such as I have described is working? Listen
to it. If it hums when plugged in, the transformer part works. If it gets warm
while trickle charging your battery, it's rectifying.

If the battery voltage rises above 12-something to about 14 volts, you've got a
cheap trickle charger that works...

 >I cant believe how hard it is to get to the damn battery on motorcycles. I can
understand the placement of the battery, but why not have some kind of
extension under one of the plastic panels or something.

My GS-1100's battery is buried underneath the air filter box. I have to remove
the box to get to the battery. I have remove the gas tank to remove the box. I
have to remove the seat to get the gas tank off. I have to remove the horns to
get the tank off.

Fuggit. I made up a wire that attaches to the battery side of the starter
solenoid and the wire comes out underneath the side cover. I don't have to
remove anything to trickle charge the battery, but it sure is hard to add
water. Next battery will be a sealed, maintenance free battery...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"bret" <poe.DeleteThis@europa.com> wrote in message
news:9901176b.0401151125.141e82ec@posting.google.com...
  > > im thinking of getting a
  > > battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens Saturday
when
  > > it will be 30F.
 >
 > A battery charger is worth the small investment.
 >
 > When was the last time you checked the levels in the battery? You need
 > to add water frequently to keep it in tip top shape. Don't put on a
 > charger until you know your battery is full.

The bike is only about a month old 2004 vtx1300.
I was reading the owners manual and it says to use a trickle charger when
charging the battery. I hope it doesn't take more then an hour to charge it
every time.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"Kaybearjr" <kaybearjr RemoveThis @aol.comical> wrote in message
news:20040115142559.19898.00000030@mb-m17.aol.com...
  > >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com
 >
  > >yep looks like I need one of those much more then a tachometer. any
 > recommendations on a charger - what not to get - what to get?
 >
 > Oh, well. You will see fancy-schmancey digital-controlled battery tending
 > devices in the catalogs for $25 to $50.
 >
 > Pay what you like, but I am a cheapskate.
 >
 > I can get the smallest conceivable battery chargers for almost nothing at
 > second hand stores. The output is less than 1 amp, usually about 600 to
800
 > milliamps. They are power supplies for charging the batteries in various
 > consumer electronic devices which people buy and use a few times and then
 > donate to a charity, like Good Will, or the Salvation Army...
 >
 > I saw a whole pile of them in a local thrift store, while I was buying an
old
 > Compaq Presario for $13. The monitor cost $7. The keyboard was almost new,
I
 > paid $4. The mouse cost $3. A power cable cost $1.
 >
 > The whole system cost me $28. It gets me on the web...

my last computer and gizmo's cost me about $4,000
and is probably worth now what you paid for yours.
i like playing video games on line so i need to keep
my computers upto date.

 >
 > I have a battery charger that I got for free, out of a trash can. I cut
the
 > plug off the end and soldered terminals onto the wires to hook up to my
 > battery. It will charge the battery up to 15 volts, and I have been using
it
 > for years...

how long does it take to charge a battery? i hope it doesnt take more then
an hour.


 >
 > If you're like me, you may even already own such a trickle charger. It may
be
 > sitting in a drawer, next to some electronic gizmo that you just had to
have
 > when they were all the rage ten years ago...

a trickle charger is what my owners manual says to use. whats the
difference?

 >
 > How do you know that a used charger such as I have described is working?
Listen
 > to it. If it hums when plugged in, the transformer part works. If it gets
warm
 > while trickle charging your battery, it's rectifying.
 >
 > If the battery voltage rises above 12-something to about 14 volts, you've
got a
 > cheap trickle charger that works...
 >
  > >I cant believe how hard it is to get to the damn battery on motorcycles.
I can
 > understand the placement of the battery, but why not have some kind of
 > extension under one of the plastic panels or something.
 >
 > My GS-1100's battery is buried underneath the air filter box. I have to
remove
 > the box to get to the battery. I have remove the gas tank to remove the
box. I
 > have to remove the seat to get the gas tank off. I have to remove the
horns to
 > get the tank off.
 >
 > Fuggit. I made up a wire that attaches to the battery side of the starter
 > solenoid and the wire comes out underneath the side cover. I don't have to
 > remove anything to trickle charge the battery, but it sure is hard to add
 > water. Next battery will be a sealed, maintenance free battery...

i seen a few chargers with connections like you mentioned.
do you have any brand names that you like?

hey thanks for the reply
Tom

 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"Kaybearjr" <kaybearjr DeleteThis @aol.comical> wrote in
news:20040115142559.19898.00000030@mb-m17.aol.com...
  > >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com
 >
  > >yep looks like I need one of those much more then a tachometer. any
 > recommendations on a charger - what not to get - what to get?
 >
 > Oh, well. You will see fancy-schmancey digital-controlled battery tending
 > devices in the catalogs for $25 to $50.
 >
 > Pay what you like, but I am a cheapskate.
 >
 > I can get the smallest conceivable battery chargers for almost nothing at
 > second hand stores. The output is less than 1 amp, usually about 600 to
800
 > milliamps. They are power supplies for charging the batteries in various
 > consumer electronic devices which people buy and use a few times and then
 > donate to a charity, like Good Will, or the Salvation Army...

<snip>

Well, that might work for you and then it's good. But according to
the battery gurus it's not a good thing. A cheap charger or other
devise that supplies the required voltage can deliver something
that is far from clean DC voltage and that is supposed to be bad
for battery life.

After years of misery with more or less useless chargers I got
one of the all electronic, "intelligent", supposed to try to
breathe life back into a half bad battery magic thingies. Not
the Optimate but with nearly the same features. I really think
it's worth the (equivalent to) $60 I gave for it.

--
Ole Holmblad - Göteborgs Prima MCK
TDM850 / XT600 FL#44 UKRMSBC#08
SGFPTH#00 Remove hat to answer by mail<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

 >From: "OH-" ole.holmblad.hat.DeleteThis@comhem.se.hat

 >A cheap charger or other devise that supplies the required voltage can deliver
something that is far from clean DC voltage and that is supposed to be bad
for battery life.

I can see where that would be true, if you used a high-amp charger...

A full-wave rectifier bridge doesn't produce straight-line DC voltage like a
battery would like to receive. It puts out
rippling DC by inverting the negative half of the sine wave, at a frequency of
60 Hz...

That's why power supply designers put great big capacitors in power supplies.
They smooth out the ripples...

But if I'm using a 600 MA charger (designed to recharge the battery in some
consumer electronics gadget) to trickle a motorcycle battery, the big battery
will probably
act as its own capacitor...

The last battery that I had to replace lasted me for 8 years, using my free
trickle charger that I pulled out of a trash can...

I've got a battery in another bike that I installed in 1996. It's still doing
well, being trickle charged when I think about it...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

in article 1074227335.787881.TakeThisOut@nntp.acecape.com, Extreme-cc's at
MrGantlet911remove.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com wrote on 1/15/04 11:28 PM:

 >
 >
 > "bret" <poe.TakeThisOut@europa.com> wrote in message
 > news:9901176b.0401151125.141e82ec@posting.google.com...
   >>> im thinking of getting a
   >>> battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens Saturday
 > when
   >>> it will be 30F.
  >>
  >> A battery charger is worth the small investment.
  >>
  >> When was the last time you checked the levels in the battery? You need
  >> to add water frequently to keep it in tip top shape. Don't put on a
  >> charger until you know your battery is full.
 >
 > The bike is only about a month old 2004 vtx1300.
 > I was reading the owners manual and it says to use a trickle charger when
 > charging the battery. I hope it doesn't take more then an hour to charge it
 > every time.
 >
 >
Sounds like a brandy new bike. The dealer should help you under warrnaty??
Unless you have a lemon battery, you just might have just a loose battery
connection. IF you take only short (2-3 mile) rides, the battery will get
run down, especially if you have a light bar.

So if you are not under warranty, you'll still need to charge up the battery
to use and test it. You might get an auto parts store to test the battery.
Just remember their reason for being is to sell stuff. A battery tender
will take a while to charge up a drained battery, but they are very good to
use if you ride only every few days.

I bought a battery tester for $50.00 4 years ago. It has jumper cable
type-clips to the battery terminals and will give me a voltage/charge
reading. The tester will also load test the battery by pulling current off
the battery through a metal coil. You hold down a button for 10 seconds
and record the lowest voltage reading. It has identified a battery short
while the battery showed a full 12.6 volt charge. Indirectly, it helped to
identify a bad alternator that was not charging the battery at all. It's
better than a hydrometer because it tests the entire battery, and will last
years.

I also use an auto trickle charge that will fully charge a drained used
battery in 1-2 hours. A brandy new battery may take 4-6 hours to charge up.
Bought it a long long time ago and it has paid for itself 100 times over.

OR, give it up to your dealer/wrench that have the same tools, and will sell
you a new battery for $70.00 plus wrench time ($50 ??). $50 plus lost rding
time, and time to take it into the shop and you're close to paying for the
tester and charger.

Ride safe,

Manjo<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

I just found the info for my battery in the owners manual.
12v - 12ah

generator = 0.364 kw/5,000rpms

is there a way to find out just what rpms I would need
to carry the lights and what ever else might drain the battery
on my bike?


from what I understand a 1 - 3 amp is a trickle charger?

I would like to have both options
fast charge and trickle charge.


I was wondering if anyone wouldn't mind taking a quick look at this page and
telling me what would be the best battery for my needs. only the ones under
hundreds of dollars .

http://www.batterymart.com/battery.mv?c=12voltchargers

I seen the optimate is a pretty well knows charger in the UK and I kind of
like it. I guess having a tester plus charger isn't so important - but I
kind of like the idea
of testing the battery at the same time I charge it. im afraid I may have
done some damage
to the weakened battery with this freezing weather the past week so I think
I would like to test
it. thank you.
Tom

--
http://www.diabetes.org/homepage.jsp
Extreme-cc's
39 - Male - Type - 2
http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/memberdetail.cfm?user_ID=162139
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

 >From: "Extreme-cc's" MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com

 >my last computer and gizmo's cost me about $4,000
 >and is probably worth now what you paid for yours.
 >i like playing video games on line so i need to keep
 >my computers upto date.

I almost bought a $2700 office system once, but I thought better of it and just
got a home computer for $1100, which is probably worth $50 now, but I have got
my mileage out of it...

Online multiplayer video games are an addiction that I have broken. One way to
break the addiction is to just walk away from the computer, the other way is to
just
refuse to update a system everytime a new microprocessor comes out..

 >how long does it take to charge a battery? i hope it doesnt take more then an
hour.

Quick charging and trickle charging are two different charging modes. You could
buy a charger which is capable of both modes, or you could just trickle charge
the battery the night before you plan to ride...

A battery is rated in ampere-hour capacity. If you have an
18 ampere-hour battery, it will put out 18 amperes for one hour without the
voltage dropping below 12 volts, if it's fully charged and in good condition...

If you want to quick charge your battery you should charge it at about 18 amps
for one hour, to avoid overheating it...

If you want to trickle charge your battery, you should charge it at 1 amp for
18 hours...

A really tiny trickle charger, such as the freebie charger I use would take
about 30 hours to completely charge a dead battery...

But I don't ever let the battery discharge completely. The idea of trickle
charging is to maintain the battery at full charge so my alternator doesn't
have to work so hard...

There are some bikes, like the Suzuki GS-series which have a very marginal
charging system, and the alternator will destroy itself, or the rectifier
regulator or the wiring trying to charge the battery. So a trickle charger is
indicated for that type of bike...

 >i seen a few chargers with connections like you mentioned. do you have any
brand names that you like?

Like I said, you could buy a fancy latest-greatest highest-technology-possible
charger advertised in the motorcycle magazines, like a Battery Tender, or you
can understand how batteries should be charged and do it yourself for little or
no investment...

I use the electronic gizmo charger I found in a trashcan to trickle charge my
motorcycles. It puts out 0.6 amps maximum...

I also have a K-Mart battery battery charger that I bought
over 25 years ago to trickle charge my car batteries. It puts out 2 amps, when
it feels like it...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"Extreme-cc's" <MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1074227335.787881@nntp.acecape.com...
 >
 >
 > "bret" <poe.TakeThisOut@europa.com> wrote in message
 > news:9901176b.0401151125.141e82ec@posting.google.com...
   > > > im thinking of getting a
   > > > battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens Saturday
 > when
   > > > it will be 30F.
  > >
  > > A battery charger is worth the small investment.
  > >
  > > When was the last time you checked the levels in the battery? You need
  > > to add water frequently to keep it in tip top shape. Don't put on a
  > > charger until you know your battery is full.
 >
 > The bike is only about a month old 2004 vtx1300.
 > I was reading the owners manual and it says to use a trickle charger when
 > charging the battery. I hope it doesn't take more then an hour to charge
it
 > every time.
 >
 >

Perhaps a call to the dealer to ask why your one-month-old battery is flat
is in order. I would be kind of irritated, as a local car dealer has found
I can be.


--

Later,

Charlie

fix the e-mail address and it will get to me<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"Charlie Gary" <cgary.DeleteThis@modelwerkshahanospamforme.com> wrote in message
news:CeZNb.57495$jJ2.19671@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
 >
 > "Extreme-cc's" <MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com> wrote in message
 > news:1074227335.787881@nntp.acecape.com...
  > >
  > >
  > > "bret" <poe.DeleteThis@europa.com> wrote in message
  > > news:9901176b.0401151125.141e82ec@posting.google.com...
   > > > > im thinking of getting a
   > > > > battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens
Saturday
  > > when
   > > > > it will be 30F.
   > > >
   > > > A battery charger is worth the small investment.
   > > >
   > > > When was the last time you checked the levels in the battery? You need
   > > > to add water frequently to keep it in tip top shape. Don't put on a
   > > > charger until you know your battery is full.
  > >
  > > The bike is only about a month old 2004 vtx1300.
  > > I was reading the owners manual and it says to use a trickle charger
when
  > > charging the battery. I hope it doesn't take more then an hour to
charge
 > it
  > > every time.
  > >
  > >
 >
 > Perhaps a call to the dealer to ask why your one-month-old battery is flat
 > is in order. I would be kind of irritated, as a local car dealer has
found
 > I can be.
 > Later,
 >
 > Charlie

I guess I could get away with that but in all honesty isn't it my fault
the battery went dead? I didn't ride it for 2 weeks in freezing weather.
also I think the bike would have started if I didn't for get to pull the
choke out
and crank it for 2 or 3 seconds before I remembered the choke.
but if you guys feel the battery still shouldn't have died - I will bring it
back.
Tom<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think? 

"Extreme-cc's" <MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1074291284.871682@nntp.acecape.com...
 >
 >
 > "Charlie Gary" <cgary RemoveThis @modelwerkshahanospamforme.com> wrote in message
 > news:CeZNb.57495$jJ2.19671@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com...
  > >
  > > "Extreme-cc's" <MrGantlet911(remove)@yahoo.com> wrote in message
  > > news:1074227335.787881@nntp.acecape.com...
   > > >
   > > >
   > > > "bret" <poe RemoveThis @europa.com> wrote in message
   > > > news:9901176b.0401151125.141e82ec@posting.google.com...
   > > > > > im thinking of getting a
   > > > > > battery charge at R & S Strauss or should I see what happens
 > Saturday
   > > > when
   > > > > > it will be 30F.
   > > > >
   > > > > A battery charger is worth the small investment.
   > > > >
   > > > > When was the last time you checked the levels in the battery? You
need
   > > > > to add water frequently to keep it in tip top shape. Don't put on a
   > > > > charger until you know your battery is full.
   > > >
   > > > The bike is only about a month old 2004 vtx1300.
   > > > I was reading the owners manual and it says to use a trickle charger
 > when
   > > > charging the battery. I hope it doesn't take more then an hour to
 > charge
  > > it
   > > > every time.
   > > >
   > > >
  > >
  > > Perhaps a call to the dealer to ask why your one-month-old battery is
flat
  > > is in order. I would be kind of irritated, as a local car dealer has
  > > found I can be.
  > > Later,
  > >
  > > Charlie
 >
 > I guess I could get away with that but in all honesty isn't it my fault
 > the battery went dead? I didn't ride it for 2 weeks in freezing weather.
 > also I think the bike would have started if I didn't for get to pull the
 > choke out
 > and crank it for 2 or 3 seconds before I remembered the choke.
 > but if you guys feel the battery still shouldn't have died - I will bring
it
 > back.
 > Tom
 >
 >

You bought a warranty with the bike, so you may as well get your money's
worth. If the battery was a year or two old I could see working out a
charging solution, and it's still something worth sorting out so you don't
get stuck again, but the only time I have batteries acting like that is when
they're old, and I've been negligent about the electrolyte levels. Does the
bike have a security system? That could cause a lot of grief with an
infrequent riding schedule.


--

Later,

Charlie

fix the e-mail address and it will get to me<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: My first Dead Battery - I think?