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hE

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Since: Mar 23, 2004
Posts: 14



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 11:21 pm
Post subject: Cylinder Pinging
Archived from groups: rec>motorcycles>tech (more info?)
I've got an '03 PW50, about 6 months old, and about 50 hours riding time on
it. About 3-4 weeks ago, I noticed a "pinging" or rattling noise coming
from the cylinder. Thought maybe it was running too lean but it checked out
OK. Then I thought it was the fuel so I switched to a 93 octane...still
pinging. Compression checks at around 115-120 psi. I removed the head and
jug and decarburized the piston crown and head and checked for signs of
scoring....didn't find any. I'm out of ideas. Any suggestions greatly
appreciated.

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The Older Gentlema2

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Since: Nov 16, 2003
Posts: 3251



(Msg. 2) Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 11:51 am
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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hE <cfdlabs.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:

 > I've got an '03 PW50, about 6 months old, and about 50 hours riding time on
 > it. About 3-4 weeks ago, I noticed a "pinging" or rattling noise coming
 > from the cylinder. Thought maybe it was running too lean but it checked out
 > OK. Then I thought it was the fuel so I switched to a 93 octane...still
 > pinging. Compression checks at around 115-120 psi. I removed the head and
 > jug and decarburized the piston crown and head and checked for signs of
 > scoring....didn't find any. I'm out of ideas. Any suggestions greatly
 > appreciated.

I think what you've got is probably normal two-stroke
ring-dinga-dinga-ding cylinder resonance.

Many air cooled two-strokes had rubber bungs rammed between the fins to
counteract it.


--
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GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 IHABWTJ#1 BOTAFOT#60 ANORAK#06
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Kaybearjr

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Since: Jun 21, 2003
Posts: 661



(Msg. 3) Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 1:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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 >From: "hE" cfdlabs.RemoveThis@yahoo.com

 >About 3-4 weeks ago, I noticed a "pinging" or rattling noise coming from the
cylinder.

Check out that exhaust pipe restrictor. Baffle could be plugged up. If the
exhaust can't get out, fresh mixture can't get in and a 2-stroke engine will
start pinging...

Engine gets so hot, the oil starts dieseling...

Really rich mixtures diesel in a 2-stroke...

Spark plug heat range might be too hot, causing preignition...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Kaybearjr

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Since: Jun 21, 2003
Posts: 661



(Msg. 4) Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 1:58 pm
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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 >chateauSPAMKILL.murray@dsl.pipex.com (The Older Gentleman)

 >I think what you've got is probably normal two-stroke
 >ring-dinga-dinga-ding cylinder resonance.

The "ring-ding" sound comes from lean misfire when the throttle is closed. The
2-stroke has a large volume of lean fuel/air mix in the intake tract and
crankcase and it misfires under low load, closed throttle operation. The fixed
ignition timing doesn't help the situation. The engine would stall if the
inertia of the motorcycle didn't keep it turning and running. 2-stroke
motorcycle engines keep running, but 2-stroke outboard motors will often stall
when the throttle is closed...

 >Many air cooled two-strokes had rubber bungs rammed between the fins to
counteract it.

That was called "cylinder ringing". The "ring-ding" noise
is also called 2-stroke "yack yack"...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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The Older Gentlema2

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Since: Nov 16, 2003
Posts: 3251



(Msg. 5) Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 4:07 pm
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Kaybearjr <kaybearjr.TakeThisOut@aol.comical> wrote:

 > 2-stroke "yack yack"

.....don't look back.


--
Trophy 1200 750SS CB400F CD200 ST70 YTC#3
GAGARPHOF#30 GHPOTHUF#1 IHABWTJ#1 BOTAFOT#60 ANORAK#06
BOF#30 WUSS#5 <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.chateau.murray.dsl.pipex.com/" target="_blank">http://www.chateau.murray.dsl.pipex.com/</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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hE

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Since: Mar 23, 2004
Posts: 14



(Msg. 6) Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2004 9:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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"Kaybearjr" <kaybearjr.RemoveThis@aol.comical> wrote in message
news:20040411085136.25461.00000153@mb-m04.aol.com...
  > >From: "hE" cfdlabs.RemoveThis@yahoo.com
 >
  > >About 3-4 weeks ago, I noticed a "pinging" or rattling noise coming from
the
 > cylinder.
 >
 > Check out that exhaust pipe restrictor. Baffle could be plugged up. If the
 > exhaust can't get out, fresh mixture can't get in and a 2-stroke engine
will
 > start pinging...

No baffle, and the spark arrestor has been thoroughly cleaned.

 > Engine gets so hot, the oil starts dieseling...
 >
 > Really rich mixtures diesel in a 2-stroke...

That's interesting. I've suspected the stroke on the oil injector pump
needed to be adjusted down for some time now. I haven't done it because I'm
afraid I'll get it too lean and seize. These &*^!@ oil injectors are a bear
to adjust properly and even worse to try and measure. I didn't know about
the dieseling though...sounds like I might need to bite the bullet and do
it...or disconnect the pump and go premix...thanks for the suggestion.

 > Spark plug heat range might be too hot, causing preignition...

Another good suggestion. I'll check that out too.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Kaybearjr

External


Since: Jun 21, 2003
Posts: 661



(Msg. 7) Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 5:17 am
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
 >From: "hE" cfdlabs.RemoveThis@yahoo.com

 > I didn't know about the dieseling though...sounds like I might need to bite
the bullet and do it...or disconnect the pump and go premix...thanks for the
suggestion.

Before going to premix, be sure that the oil injection pump isn't necessary to
feed the rod big end bearings, like is Suzuki's practice...

Also, some 2-stroke crankshaft designs had big thin washers locating the rod
side-to-side. Those designs need lots of oil in the mix...

  >> Spark plug heat range might be too hot, causing preignition...

 >Another good suggestion. I'll check that out too.

I had hot spark plugs burn holes in my pistons at least twice before I figured
out that I couldn't run the same spark plugs in my car and my Yamaha too...

And, I also discovered that carbon plugging up the baffles made my Yammie
ping...

Pinging sounds like a loose valve, but you know that your 2-smoke has no valves
to get loose...

Pinging eats away at the aluminum piston top a little bit at a time...

Detonating makes a metallic clanging sound or bang, and detonating will break
the porcelin insulator nose of your spark plug...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Kaybearjr

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Since: Jun 21, 2003
Posts: 661



(Msg. 8) Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2004 5:29 am
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
 >chateauSPAMKILL.murray@dsl.pipex.com (The Older Gentleman)

  >> 2-stroke "yack yack"
 >
 >....don't look back.

Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Take out the papers and the trash
Or you don't get no spendin' cash
If you don't scrub that kitchen floor
You ain't gonna rock and roll no more
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Just finish cleanin' up your room
Let's see that dust fly with that broom
Get all that garbage out of sight
Or you don't go out Friday night
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

You just put on your coat and hat
And walk yourself to the laundromat
And when you finish doin' that
Bring in the dog and put out the cat
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Don't you give me no dirty looks
Your father's hip; he knows what cooks
Just tell your hoodlum friend outside
You ain't got time to take a ride
Yakety yak (don't talk back)

Yakety yak, yakety yak
Yakety yak, yakety yak
Yakety yak, yakety yak
Yakety yak, yakety yak

Coasters 1950-something?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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David Hajicek

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Since: Jan 31, 2004
Posts: 6



(Msg. 9) Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2004 10:46 pm
Post subject: Re: Cylinder Pinging [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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Thank you. That brings back memories.

Dave Hajicek

"Kaybearjr" <kaybearjr.RemoveThis@aol.comical> wrote in message
news:20040412002910.00620.00000210@mb-m07.aol.com...
  > >chateauSPAMKILL.murray@dsl.pipex.com (The Older Gentleman)
 >
   > >> 2-stroke "yack yack"
  > >
  > >....don't look back.
 >
 > Yakety yak (don't talk back)
 >
 > Take out the papers and the trash
 > Or you don't get no spendin' cash
 > If you don't scrub that kitchen floor
 > You ain't gonna rock and roll no more
 > Yakety yak (don't talk back)
 >
 > Just finish cleanin' up your room
 > Let's see that dust fly with that broom
 > Get all that garbage out of sight
 > Or you don't go out Friday night
 > Yakety yak (don't talk back)
 >
 > You just put on your coat and hat
 > And walk yourself to the laundromat
 > And when you finish doin' that
 > Bring in the dog and put out the cat
 > Yakety yak (don't talk back)
 >
 > Don't you give me no dirty looks
 > Your father's hip; he knows what cooks
 > Just tell your hoodlum friend outside
 > You ain't got time to take a ride
 > Yakety yak (don't talk back)
 >
 > Yakety yak, yakety yak
 > Yakety yak, yakety yak
 > Yakety yak, yakety yak
 > Yakety yak, yakety yak
 >
 > Coasters 1950-something?
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 >
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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