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External
Since: Jun 21, 2004
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:43 pm
Post subject: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder
Archived from groups: rec>motorcycles>dirt (more info?)
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this may sound a little wierd, but recently i have noticed this
extremely distinctive "pinging" noise coming from the engine of my
1981 KDX 175. So I took the engine apart: hoping it was the wrist
pin, i replaced it. It seemed to help decrease the noise a little but
i could still hear it. So i took the engine apart again. This time,
when i was about to pull the piston out of the cylinder i noticed that
i could move the piston side-to-side within the cylinder walls. I can
only guess that the piston rings slowly deteriorated (or something)
the cylinder walls. Now i think my only option is to bore out the
cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
anything would be helpful..
Thanks, Matt |
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External
Since: Nov 15, 2003
Posts: 121
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:09 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 20:43:42 -0700, Matt wrote:
[...]
> Now i think my only option is to bore out the
> cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
> Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
> different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
> because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
> anything would be helpful..
Find a dirt magazine or Cycle News and contact one or more of the cylinder
replating specialists. Only someone who is going to do the job for you can
answer as to whether or not it can be done. In addition to replating some
offer the alternative of an iron sleeve pressed in. An iron sleeve may be
necessary to make up for lost material and return to your proper bore
diameter.
Yes, Kawasaki's idea with the KDX 175 was that the entire cylinder be
replaced rather than overbore. That was fairly radical thinking back then
but common today. As a result replating specialists can get enough
business to pay their employees.
Even if you did overbore the cylinder you'd be faced with a problem
finding an overbore piston for a model the manufacturer didn't offer same.
Wiseco may have one but then then the piston would be running on bare
aluminum without a replate.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> |
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External
Since: Jul 17, 2003
Posts: 19
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 5:31 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I'm thinkin' in 81 you probably won't find anything exotic in a 175.
You should be able to tell if there is a steel sleeve by visual
inspection. If so, get a piston, punch it, have a nice day. If the
cylinder appears to be one piece, it may be a coated unit but, as
stated above, if oversized pistons are available your probably safe.
Good luck. >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jun 23, 2003
Posts: 241
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 9:31 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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It's boreable if it's not plated. It's not boreable if it is. You
should be able to tell by looking at it. I think it is plated, though.
Kawasaki was one of the first to plate their cylinders and I think
they started by 1981. Well, actually, it can be bored even if it is
plated, it will just need replated after the bore job.
James
00CR250
fordtrucks05.RemoveThis@cox.net (Matt) wrote...
> this may sound a little wierd, but recently i have noticed this
> extremely distinctive "pinging" noise coming from the engine of my
> 1981 KDX 175. So I took the engine apart: hoping it was the wrist
> pin, i replaced it. It seemed to help decrease the noise a little but
> i could still hear it. So i took the engine apart again. This time,
> when i was about to pull the piston out of the cylinder i noticed that
> i could move the piston side-to-side within the cylinder walls. I can
> only guess that the piston rings slowly deteriorated (or something)
> the cylinder walls. Now i think my only option is to bore out the
> cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
> Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
> different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
> because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
> anything would be helpful..
> Thanks, Matt<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jun 21, 2004
Posts: 14
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:30 pm
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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>On 21 Jun 2004 20:43:42 -0700, fordtrucks05.DeleteThis@cox.net (Matt) wrote:
>this may sound a little wierd, but recently i have noticed this
>extremely distinctive "pinging" noise coming from the engine of my
>1981 KDX 175. So I took the engine apart: hoping it was the wrist
>pin, i replaced it. It seemed to help decrease the noise a little but
>i could still hear it. So i took the engine apart again. This time,
>when i was about to pull the piston out of the cylinder i noticed that
>i could move the piston side-to-side within the cylinder walls. I can
>only guess that the piston rings slowly deteriorated (or something)
>the cylinder walls. Now i think my only option is to bore out the
>cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
>Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
>different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
>because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
>anything would be helpful..
>Thanks, Matt
I don't remember when Kawasaki went to a plated cylinder with the
KDX, (it was around that time period) but if yours is plated, the
most cost effective course of action will be to have it replated.
Borable sleeves are right at $69, and installing them and matching
the ports is often over $100 in labor.
Recoating the cylinder can build up worn surfaces and be honed to
"true" and to an specified tolerance to the supplied (you supply)
piston.
In addition to the job costing less money, a recoated cylinder has a
better heat exchange capabilities than a sleeved cylinder.
Jim Cook
Gas Gas Woods Rider
Team LAGNAF
BJEC/SERA/TSCEC/AHSCS
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.smackovermotorsports.com" target="_blank">www.smackovermotorsports.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jun 22, 2004
Posts: 6
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:05 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Matt" <fordtrucks05.DeleteThis@cox.net> wrote in message
news:fedffcaf.0406211943.733feea@posting.google.com...
> this may sound a little wierd, but recently i have noticed this
> extremely distinctive "pinging" noise coming from the engine of my
> 1981 KDX 175. So I took the engine apart: hoping it was the wrist
> pin, i replaced it. It seemed to help decrease the noise a little but
> i could still hear it. So i took the engine apart again. This time,
> when i was about to pull the piston out of the cylinder i noticed that
> i could move the piston side-to-side within the cylinder walls. I can
> only guess that the piston rings slowly deteriorated (or something)
> the cylinder walls. Now i think my only option is to bore out the
> cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
> Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
> different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
> because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
> anything would be helpful..
> Thanks, Matt
I am certain that your 175 does NOT have a nikasil plated cylinder.
Kawasaki didn't do that in 1981. BTW, that 175 was faster than the 200 that
came out later on. It had more top end punch, alot more. Atleast it felt
like it.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jun 22, 2004
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:45 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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You need to get a measurement of the piston, since those cylinders
didn`t wear out like a normal steel cylinder. I had an 82 Kawasaki
and if I remember right, they called their cylinder coating Nikasil.
They can loose their finish, glaze over, have pieces of the coating
chip off, but they don`t wear oversize unless they have a lot of time
on them. You might only need a new piston. As far a side to side
movement, most pistons will do that to some extent when they are cold.
Keep in mind a 22 yr old motor willl probably have lots of worn parts
though. Be sure to check the connecting rod bottom end bearing also.
there should be no up and down play at all there. But get the cylinder
checked by a shop if you can. Clearances are super important, you need
to know where your at with clearances first. When you find what`s
loose, then you`ll find what is making noise. One last note, those
old Kawi`s were noisy at the cylinder to begin with, so something worn
only make the thing sound more obnoxious.
Jack
On 21 Jun 2004 20:43:42 -0700, fordtrucks05 RemoveThis @cox.net (Matt) wrote:
>this may sound a little wierd, but recently i have noticed this
>extremely distinctive "pinging" noise coming from the engine of my
>1981 KDX 175. So I took the engine apart: hoping it was the wrist
>pin, i replaced it. It seemed to help decrease the noise a little but
>i could still hear it. So i took the engine apart again. This time,
>when i was about to pull the piston out of the cylinder i noticed that
>i could move the piston side-to-side within the cylinder walls. I can
>only guess that the piston rings slowly deteriorated (or something)
>the cylinder walls. Now i think my only option is to bore out the
>cylinder and buy an oversized piston.
>Now my question is: Is this even possible?? I have heard two
>different stories. Yes and No. Yes, well that's obvious.. But no
>because the cylinder walls are not "boreable". Any thoughts on this?
>anything would be helpful..
>Thanks, Matt<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jul 19, 2003
Posts: 16
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:47 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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External
Since: Jun 22, 2004
Posts: 6
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Jun 23, 2004 2:17 pm
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"IRONDOG" <irondog DeleteThis @usol.com> wrote in message
news:BfSdnRg1HejihETdRVn-tw@giganews.com...
> All KDX175s were electrofusion (plated) bore, and every KX from the 60 to
> the 500 has had a plated cylinder since the KX's were introduced in 1974.
>
> IRONDOG
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.dirtbikeswapmeet.com</font" target="_blank">www.dirtbikeswapmeet.com</font</a>>
>
>
Wow, I didn't realize how fast my post would fish out the correct
answer but it did. Insist on something that you know NOTHING about ( as in
my case I don't really know much about the KDX LOL!) and the answer will be
posted relatively fast by people trying to prove you wrong, it ALWAYS
works:). Well there is your answer Matt!.............you're welcome.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jul 19, 2003
Posts: 16
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2004 3:08 am
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Pete wrote:
: Wow, I didn't realize how fast my post would fish out the
correct
: answer but it did. Insist on something that you know NOTHING about ( as in
: my case I don't really know much about the KDX LOL!) and the answer will
be
: posted relatively fast by people trying to prove you wrong, it ALWAYS
: works:). Well there is your answer Matt!.............you're welcome.
*********************
No intentions of trying to prove you wrong, just trying to impart a little
knowledge to the masses. I just happened to have these factoids at the
forefront of my brain and managed to get them out before they became clouded
and lost.
IRONDOG
www.dirtbikeswapmeet.com >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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External
Since: Jun 22, 2004
Posts: 6
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2004 2:34 pm
Post subject: Re: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"IRONDOG" <irondog.RemoveThis@usol.com> wrote in message
news:_bednfJY9OxB8kfdRVn_iw@giganews.com...
>
>
> Pete wrote:
> : Wow, I didn't realize how fast my post would fish out the
> correct
> : answer but it did. Insist on something that you know NOTHING about ( as
in
> : my case I don't really know much about the KDX LOL!) and the answer will
> be
> : posted relatively fast by people trying to prove you wrong, it ALWAYS
> : works:). Well there is your answer Matt!.............you're welcome.
> *********************
>
> No intentions of trying to prove you wrong, just trying to impart a little
> knowledge to the masses. I just happened to have these factoids at the
> forefront of my brain and managed to get them out before they became
clouded
> and lost.
> IRONDOG
No problem dude and thanks for the information, I was curious
myself.
Pete
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.dirtbikeswapmeet.com</font" target="_blank">www.dirtbikeswapmeet.com</font</a>>
>
><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 1981 KDX 175 & boring the cylinder |
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